Random Thread ~Usagi-Chan ☮ Tūsurī~

[Starra]

It's hard to really measure your growth and progress without tests, not that tests really measure everything (and I'm speaking from a public school teacher point of view -- I know the frustration every day). Language is first and foremost for communication, so if you're able to use it in authentic contexts, like even just watching movies and consuming any real-world content, that's more productive than just taking classes and studying and, say, trying to learn obscure kanji just for the sake of learning more characters. Also, you're going to be more conscious of what you don't know than what you know. Like if you find yourself not getting lost in Japan you'd just go about your way, whereas if you're lost because of language issue then you'd be frustrated.

You're right. I think a big part of my problem is that I'm a perfectionist, so I'm never going to be satisfied with how much I know about something until I know everything. Which... simply isn't possible with languages at all, obviously. (They do not work like that!)

In preparation for my first trip to Japan, 17 years ago, I managed to get to a certain level of proficiency fairly quickly and easily: able to have simple conversations, order food, ask for and understand directions, find what I want in a Japanese CD shop without assistance, etc. The problem is that I never progressed much further than that. Sure, I can chit-chat about H!P with a fellow H!P fan, but show me a Japanese movie without subtitles and I'll only understand dribs and drabs. If I practiced every day, that would help, but I don't.

Big mood, man. I've tried watching Japanese news broadcasts and whenever they talk about politics I can't follow along at all. Not that foreign politics matter quite that much, but, well, it's still annoying.

Ain't that the truth! If you don't practice every day, they'll fade faster than anything. At my very best, my knowledge of kanji was no better than that of a Japanese third-grader, and I'm sure it's worse now. My ability to recognize kanji doesn't fade so quickly, but my ability to write them certainly does. Lately I've been having brain farts where I can't even remember how to write certain kana. I really need to get back into the habit of writing Japanese, because typing rōmaji input and letting a computer do all the heavy lifting does precious little to aid the memory.

See, I at least have the excuse of not being able to even write in English without immense difficulty, so I've never really learnt how to write kanji. I can write hiragana and katakana (kind of) but aside from super basic kanji (like, 2-3 strokes max) I have no idea what I'm doing. I can't hold a pen properly (never been able to) and my hands get sore if I write more than a couple of paragraphs. And even then, my handwriting is barely legible.

Because of that, I've never worried about my ability to write kanji. I can definitely read/recognise quite a few of them, however.

Also, particles will be the death of me. I know there's logic to them and I'm just dumb but how am I supposed to remember the difference between は and が... I always struggle with を, に and で too.

Not that English makes any sense, lol. It's such a joke of a language.

[Zunu]

Even a lot of Japanese people have trouble remembering kanji they don't often use. They might recognize them in a book but not be able to write them anymore.

[Starra]

Makes sense to me. A lot of it is context-based, too, from my knowledge, so in my experience, your brain is more likely to fill in the gaps when you're reading a full sentence versus just the kanji by itself.

[erilaz]

Because of that, I've never worried about my ability to write kanji.

For me personally, being able to write well-formed and elegant kanji is as important a goal as proficiency in speaking and reading. I'd love to be properly trained in 書道 someday and become an accomplished calligrapher like Sayashi and Takechan.

[Starra]

Because of that, I've never worried about my ability to write kanji.

For me personally, being able to write well-formed and elegant kanji is as important a goal as proficiency in speaking and reading. I'd love to be properly trained in 書道 someday and become an accomplished calligrapher like Sayashi and Takechan.

Oh, I absolutely get that! I think kanji are neat, and there's definitely a skill to writing them artistically. Calligraphy is amazing to me, and I do admire people who are able to do it in any language.

But since I'm unfortunately too disabled to even partake, it's one of those things I personally am not worried about with my own learning. If I was able to write kanji properly, I'd definitely focus on practicing it more, if that makes sense!

My other issue is that I have absolutely shit visual memory, so I can't picture kanji in my mind while I'm writing them. I know if you write them over and over again it becomes automatic eventually, but I'm not sure if I'd be able to get to that point.

At most I can write, like, 口 lol.

[TotallyUncool]

Late last night, I started the install for the latest Windows 10 update (my desktop system doesn't quite meet the qualifications for Windows 11, and I don't want to push it). After about 10 hours, the update failed, and the blue screen message said that it would restart after sending the technical info to Microsoft. After an hour or so, it still showed the blue screen, so I shut the power off and restarted it. It then took another hour or two to repair Windows and restart, and I'm currently catching up with all of the work and personal stuff that got delayed as a result.

[Starra]

Well... I've taken the plunge and done something about my shit level of Japanese:

I've started a new Twitter account where I'll only be tweeting in Japanese. About my current obsession. Which is, for whatever reason, the new Pokemon anime. Mostly it's tweets about a certain character and pairing, but hey, there's no better practice than interacting with actual Japanese people, and I figure social media's the only real place I can do it.

So far I've even tried writing a couple of short fanfics, too. I was doing a lot of fanfic writing in English for a couple of years, but for some reason, I don't have the motivation to do it anymore. Even though I have several unfinished fics sitting there on a certain fanfic website.

I feel like I can express things pretty decently in English, but trying to convey emotions in Japanese is... a challenge, lol. Hopefully I'll get better at it as I go.

The fanfic I posted the other day has gotten a bit more interaction than I was expecting (15 bookmarks somehow? It's very short so I thought it'd get like 3 at most) and I only just put up the second one... Hopefully it's readable.

Whenever I post things in Japanese I always find myself overly apologising for my lack of skill, which is something I need to stop doing. I do think it's not a bad idea to warn people that Japanese isn't my first language, however, so that way they're not completely taken by surprise.

[Zunu]

Congrats!

I do think it's not a bad idea to warn people that Japanese isn't my first language, however, so that way they're not completely taken by surprise.

I wonder if that's necessary? Think about posters you've come across whose first language isn't English. Sometimes you can immediately tell, in which case you don't need to be warned, and sometimes you can't, either because 1) they're so good that it's a moot question, or because 2) they're pretty good and you just haven't noticed yet, or because 3) they're sticking to really simple comments, and it doesn't matter.

True, sometimes people will helpfully inform you their English is L2 because either they don't quite understand what you're saying, or vice-versa. But in that case it's in response to a problem, not just a general, "Hey just wanted to let you know in advance I'm not completely fluent." Which brings up my final point, I think more than English, Japanese people can very readily separate fluent from non-fluent writing unless you're sticking to stuff like 可愛すぎ！！！ and 笑笑笑笑, because aside from the labyrinthian difficulties of the core language, as foreigners we're lacking in cultural referents. In a widespread language like English, there is no one singular culture. So if somebody doesn't know what you mean by "I've gotta pop over to the Unichem's," it could be they don't understand the "pop over" idiom or are just unfamiliar with your regional retail environment. But with Japanese, 99% of its speakers are Japanese, and live in Japan. And Japanese is monocultural to a far greater extent than most large nations.

[esm]

I’ve been trying to study Japanese since I’ll be in Japan in a few weeks (pretty unreal to be able to say this). But I’ll also be in Germany and France later in the summer and I’ve studied both German and French so I need to study up those languages too because I just don’t want to seem clueless.

Though it also makes me appreciate the fact that even though I’ve barely used Thai for so many years now I will always understand everything even know the writing is crazy (spelling is more irregular than English). I probably don’t even think in Thai. Like English speakers wouldn’t know what it’s like because you’d hardly get to not use English much anywhere, at least not for years and years, so you take for granted how well your brain learned your first language.

[TotallyUncool]

So many things stay with us for years, and get filed away, but are still there - and language is such an incredibly basic part of how our minds work!